[PAA-Discuss] Confused again I am

Sun Oct 15 20:12:07 EDT 2006

Ditto, Brenda & Robert

We shall see who "wins" and what the real (su)prize is .in time. 

Sherry

-----Original Message-----
From: discuss-bounces at paa-tx.org [mailto:discuss-bounces at paa-tx.org] On
Behalf Of Brenda
Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2006 6:18 PM
To: PAA Discussion List
Subject: Re: [PAA-Discuss] Confused again I am

Hi Robert, 

I agree with your comments totally! And, I am sick and tired of being a
puppet for the current 2 party system. We are just a bunch of pawns being
used by the wealthy that own this country! And, as long as they keep us
believing that we can actually change things they keep us compliant 

The democrats will likely win many big races this fall and that will serve
to keep them thinking that there is hope when, in my opinion there is no
hope in stopping this total fascist take over of the US. Both the Republican
and the Democratic parties are primarily comprised of fascists, save a few
exceptions. :(

Brenda

----- Original Message ----- 

From: robert <mailto:rgg-629 at sbcglobal.net>  

To: ChasMauch at aol.com ; PaulandCarole at msn.com ; discuss at paa-tx.org 

Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2006 3:00 AM

Subject: Re: [PAA-Discuss] Confused again I am

Of course no question about the cowardice and immorality of the Democratic
Party's leaders. All what I am saying, when you hold United States leaders
(from both parties) against high standards you are implicitly praising them
when they don't deserve.

This country (USA) had been established on immortals and abuse and torture
of the human race.. I can't think of a moral reference point in the American
history that any contemporary leader can be benched-marked against. They can
only sink more.

In this context, I don't see what Clinton's remarks on the torture are
outrageous. And whether the Democratic Party will come back to power or not
has nothing to do with all this media circus. It is all going according to a
master plan. In other words the Democratic Party lost the two last elections
by elections fraud and by the complicity of its leaders not because of the
failure of their strategies and policies. And they are going to be brought
back to power when it is the right time, regardless of how well or bad they
do. We just entertain ourselves by making sense of nonsense.

robert

  _____  

From: discuss-bounces at paa-tx.org [mailto:discuss-bounces at paa-tx.org] On
Behalf Of ChasMauch at aol.com
Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 11:41 AM
To: PaulandCarole at msn.com; discuss at paa-tx.org
Subject: Re: [PAA-Discuss] Confused again I am

In a message dated 10/13/06 4:04:06 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
PaulandCarole at msn.com writes:

After reading the link below I ask why there is such an effort to impeach
Bush or vote democrats into office when the time might be better spent to
displace the Democratic party leadership and so called liberals in think
tanks.

http://rightweb.irc-online.org/rw/3584

It makes sense to do what we can to improve and reform the parties and the
entire political system, but I have long believed that the system was
deliberately set up to be run by the wealthy (an oligarchy) right from the
start, it has worked that way all along, and changing it is exceedingly
difficult. There are many good discussions of the situation, and one of the
best is by Chomsky in "Necessary Illusions." I have copied four small items
(from among the many good ones) in his detailed discussion, which can be
read in its entiriety at the link shown below. Here are the four:

1.   John Jay, president of the Continental Congress and first chief justice
of the U.S. Supreme Court, said in what his biographer calls one of his
favorite maxims: "The people who own the country ought to govern it." Jay's
maxim is, in fact, the principle on which the Republic was founded and
maintained, and in its very nature capitalist democracy cannot stray far
from this pattern for reasons that are readily perceived. 

2.   Elsewhere, Gouverneur Morris observes that in the post-revolutionary
society, "what one had in effect was a political democracy manipulated by an
elite," and in states where "egalitarian democracy" might appear to have
prevailed (as in Virginia), in reality "dominance of the aristocracy was
implicitly accepted." The same is true of the dominance of the rising
business classes in later periods that are held to reflect the triumph of
popular democracy. <http://www.zmag.org/Chomsky/ni/ni-c01-s05.html#FN35> 35 

3.   At another point on the spectrum, the conservative contempt for
democracy is succinctly articulated by Sir Lewis Namier, who writes that
"there is no free will in the thinking and actions of the masses, any more
than in the revolutions of planets, in the migrations of birds, and in the
plunging of hordes of lemmings into the sea."
<http://www.zmag.org/Chomsky/ni/ni-c01-s06.html#FN42> 42 Only disaster would
ensue if the masses were permitted to enter the arena of decision-making in
a meaningful way. 

4.   At its root, the logic is that of the Grand Inquisitor, who bitterly
assailed Christ for offering people freedom and thus condemning them to
misery. The Church must correct the evil work of Christ by offering the
miserable mass of humanity the gift they most desire and need: absolute
submission. It must "vanquish freedom" so as "to make men happy" and provide
the total "community of worship" that they avidly seek. In the modern
secular age, this means worship of the state religion, which in the Western
democracies incorporates the doctrine of submission to the masters of the
system of public subsidy, private profit, called free enterprise. The people
must be kept in ignorance, reduced to jingoist incantations, for their own
good.

For discussion of these items and much more in greater depth and detail,
check this link:

http://www.zmag.org/Chomsky/ni/ni-c01-s05.html 

Charlie M

  _____  

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